A lot of us have seen deadmau5(Joel), can tend to go off the grid and Rant and Rave on Facebook, twitter and other social sites from time to time. For example, like he did recently saying DJ’s simply “press play” which triggered a huge stink among Dj’s, Afrojack in particular. Now deadmau5 is lashing out at Afrojack about his recent comment at the EDMBiz conference in Vegas this past June.
The whole point of this conference is an entire post itself (which you can read here), but for the sake of this article we will cherry pick to keep it focused on the underlying beef between Mau5′ and Jack’. 
So, in short, the whole point of this EDMBiz conference is to talk about everything EDM, and to assist, a panel of artists, which included: Afrojack, Dash Berlin, Dirty South, Borgore and more were brought on to provide working professional insight. Afrojack commented on one of the main topics of discussion that really seemed to strike a nerve with Joel which was when this panel was asked, “is there a dance music bubble”? Which in turn, Afrojack replied back, “it’s simple, if you make good music, you succeed, if you don’t, you won’t” and the other artists agreed.
This is what Joel had to say in retrospect to Afrojack’s statement above.
Joel’s response then led to a twitter out lash from Afrojack:
Joel is threatened by Afrojack’s comments, it seems, which, is actually quite good! Being that this conference is in a large part business related, how investors are being called in to talk about how they can capitalize on the vast popularity gain of EDM music. Joel feels threatened because it could quite possibly commercialize EDM to the point of pop music these days which forces songs to follow a specific format. That could eliminate the creative and experimental aspect of EDM to the point where a song would be just pushed through a template.
your shit dead rat.
they both make good points, I just don’t like the bitching.
Deadmau5 is completely right. Fuck Afro Jack. All EDM sounds the exact fucking same now. All the popular shit at least. The crap you hear at every festival. All these big name DJs play the same tracks over and over with the same beat over and over! Enough already. Deadmau5 is pisdrd because when you say make a “good track” your talking about making the same repetitive shit. This was made so clear to me at EDC this year. EDM is a fad. And its horrible. Your turning it into the same pop bullshit like everything else. Break away from it. For the sake of the true EDM fans.
I’m not sure how he personally would feel “threatened” over the already commercialized ‘EDM pop music scene’…it will never eliminate the creativity or the experimental ideas of present/future innovative artists. I mean sure following a specific formula will make people some money(after all it always has), but I feel that there will always be people looking past the standardized structure of a ‘hit song’ for something more fulfilling. To me those people are the ones who truly appreciate music in my opinion.
EDM is becoming capitalized on whether Joel likes it or not. Sadly Afrojack will be ruining EDM alongside David Guetta.
EDM music sucks ass today… With an exception to proper HOUSE music… Afro and Mau5 are both template making douchbags… Joel just needs to shut his mouth and put down the needle… If he has so much hate, then get out and fuck off… And it’t not about good music anymore… It’s all about marketing… SKILLS BE DAMNED! http://www.facebook.com/jefphillipsdj
2 overrated artists going at each other lol.
Deadmau5 is actually a decent producer though…while Afrojack hasn’t produced a decent tune since 2010 lol.
As much a of a douchebag deadmau5 is, he is still a far superior musical talent than Afrojack. So I feel as though his words carry more weight than Nick’s do.
Considering mau5 was a major part in the commercialization of edm…yeah he could,can and always will be able to suck it.
haha the statement afrojack made is quite funny… as far as I can tell, he hasn’t been making good music, but he’s been quite successful… sooo I’m totally with the mau5 on this one. last good track afrojack made was called bang duck and it wasn’t even original… it was a total rip off of a boris dlugosch’s track “bangkok” and the oliver twizt remix of polkadots is better than the original. that’s the only other afrojack track I used to like.
I think what I find interesting is that they are both arguing, yet both are “guilty” of putting out the “formulated 4/4, 128” style that Deadmau5 bemoaned. It seems to me that they are both missing the point.
EDM has become commercialized. This is the nature of Capitalism. It doesn’t ruin EDM, or destroy it. It merely means that a lot of people are more accepting of it. There are those that like the mainstream sound, and those that don’t. Don’t hate on the people that like the mainstream just because you don’t, that’s not PLUR.
Afrojack was a little vague in his answer that you just have to make “good” music to stay popular. He also didn’t answer the question that was asked. EDM IS a bubble that will eventually burst. Just like Boy Bands and Pop Punk, EDM is enjoying it’s stint as the current top Pop music (pop being short for popular), which brings out the people who are more trendy than others and want to make money along with their music. To each their own, in my humble opinion.
The answer to both of them is quite simple: if you’re making the music to make money, then do what you think will be successful. Just because you follow the formula of Electro (128BPM, 1:30 intro and buildup, drop, bridge, buildup, drop, 1:00 outro) doesn’t guarantee that all your instrument sounds and synth sounds and melody and structure are going to resonate with the hundreds of thousands of eager listeners. But if you make music simply because you love it, then don’t worry about what anyone else thinks, because you’re making music for you.
Honestly, does anyone think this exact debate hasn’t occurred in EVERY genre of music as it came up? Rock, rap, country, folk, blues…I guarantee you this exact debate has happened amongst their own respective leaders as well.
PLUR people, PLUR. It’s not just an acronym, it’s supposed to be a way of life.
Also, as much as I love the new Daft Punk album, it’s not innovative or forward-thinking. In fact, it’s exactly the opposite. They went “back” to the roots of musicianship and musicality and got studio musicians to play instruments to songs they wrote. Just like every other band in the world has done that has made music. It was just a change of pace from the current trends in EDM of intense sounds and big drops. – my 2 cents.
I completely agree with Deadmau5. He’s just calling out afro in the sense “good music” shouldn’t me its a good money maker tune. but something you make for yourself, to express yourself and just to make a genuine experience for the listener, not cash flow. and I don’t think hes scared hes just being a bigger man and biting his tongue, cause if he was scared he would never have called afro out in the first place.
Instead of crying about it, why not do something new and different. Words don’t mean shit unless you do something about it!
we are witnessing what has happened to other fad from Abercrombie to Livestrong bands happen right before our eyes because of people producing the same stuff over and over again. People can produce whatever they want, but I give credit to big names like deadmau5 for progressing the genre rather than keeping it stagnant
Daft Punk ‘Random Access Memories’. Accepted. Charted #1. “Fight the war, fuck the norm.” -Rage Against The Machine. End of conversation.
Anymore brain-busters?
Deadmau5 is right but you have to read this with knowing that Afrojack just started his second alias “Far Far Away” that is exactly what maus is say “music that matters to you” https://soundcloud.com/afrojack/far-far-away-robot-city.
Afrojack’s comment on music wasn’t really good. Look at the Beatport Top 100. More like the Top 20. All of them run by the same format. Ain’t nothing really new. Yeahh some get away from that format and do well but they’re not making bank like the rest of these copycats.
I love Joel and his music but he complains too much! Chill out, bro! Worry about yourself! lol
DEADMAU5 IS HATTING CUZ AFROJACK STILL CAN MAKE SONGS AND HE HASn’t TOOK OUT SHIT SINCE 4*4 SO SHUT THE FUCK UP AND MAKE SOME NEW SHIT ALL DEADMAUS PLAYS IS THE SAME TRACKS ALL THE TIME THAT SHIT GET BORRING TRY SOME THING NEW LOOK AT ULTRA THIS YEAR BOTH OF DEADMAUS SETS WHERE THE SAME SONGS BOTH WEEKENDS LOOKS LIKE HE IS THE ONE JUST PUSHING PLAY.
I can only share disappointment in the EDM scene as of recent years. Hard work is not paying off anymore and the singular synth-drop tracks that take no more than 9 to 15 hours of work and chart overnight at most are prevailing, and Afrojack sets a great example of such.
Remember how it used to be? Everyone was living peacefully, only the true listeners and open-minded fans of EDM existed, no arguing, no nothing. It was all based on how creative you were no matter what genre of EDM you produced (be it Complextro, Heavy Electro, or just progressive house). Sadly nowadays, it’s either you, or the ‘exposure’, that is the reach. You either WORK HARD, and keep it at a low profile (because that’s just how it is), or you produce what we call a “Mainstream” track that will get you the exposure you’d want, but you would not be satisfied with yourself. It’s like lying to yourself. I have seen lots of artists deviate to the mainstream just to get the extra exposure.
Music is music, it is art. Those who want to profit out of it at the cost of spreading disease-like tracks shouldn’t even be involved with it in the first place.
You’re missing the point. Afrojack produces garbage that all sounds the same with the addition of collaborating with a bunch of stupid pop artists (e.g. Chris Brown). Deadmau5 stays true to what he does and none of his tracks sound the same.
He was referring to electronic music I’m sure based on the panel being at EDM Biz (before EDC Las Vegas), in which neither of these would artists (only applying to their new album, which was more pop funk) would even apply.
Totally with Deadmau5 and Wolfgang Gartner (who said something similar about this) on the current disgraceful state of edm. Though I find it funny how the guy who hasn’t produced a decent tune in years and is collaborating with idiots like Paris Hilton is perfectly fine with and ENCOURAGES flinging shit around at the uneducated masses, while bitching at two very well respected talents that are saying it needs to be stopped.
They don’t get any smarter or appreciate better quality if you don’t teach them why its bad afro, but hey you’re just in it for the money anyway.
This
None of Deadmau5′ songs sound the same? I can name 10 that sound the same.
I agree Afrojack has help when producing huge hits, like Take over control, etc. But his new EP sucks so bad.
Now figuring this shit out? I was preaching this shit like almost three years ago lol. But yeah, totally agree.
I think you missed my point. And no, he was not just referring to the artists on the EDM Biz panel, he was referring to the entire industry. You and I both know that the EDM Biz panel is complete blasphemy, based on monetary endeavors alone. Insomniac is Satan. And, you know of all people that I love mau5, but everyone and their mom knows that the EDM “experience” is becoming way too mainstream/monotonous. My point was that true talent will define where the industry is headed. You don’t always have to bitch about it…Maybe I should also update everyone on my relationship issues via Facebook so everyone knows my current dating status. Jesus. This guy has more life issues than Lindsay Lohan. Daft Punk releases a pop funk electronic album a midst the pure banger theory of “good music”… it charts #1. The album took 5 years to make and is arguably more geared toward their original roots than anything they have previously released. Despite it’s irregularities, it managed to succeed, and continues to succeed. The industry might be a fad, the experience might be a fad, but the music will live on.
Deadmau5 for example lacks so much creativity with his later work, I still like a couple songs by him. David Guetta can jump off a fucking cliff, and Tiesto can’t change his style for shit neither. Nobody who works really hard on their work gets noticed, and its sad.
I agree with Deadmau5.
I agree with Deadmau5.
It’s the same everywhere, not just in the EDM scene, you can’t blame the artists, if you feel like pointing fingers, call out the industry. We can’t gauge quality when it comes to music; a track that took 3 hours to produce can still hold alot of value to the artist, not to say it should overshadow more ambitious endeavors though.
In other words, You could still give Guetta or Tiesto credit for being consistent, but it’s the way the industry has been working ass backwards that set them ahead of producers that actually deserve it.
All well and good, Joel Zimmerman is right about it the music is a cookie cutter sound. But he didn’t help that process with his latest two releases. They weren’t anythign special just like afrojack isn’t anything special. If your really listening to edm then your not listening to all the electrohouse, the big house, and the dubstep. Your listening to the underground stuff, past and present. Were talking Oakenfold and Van Dyk with trance, we’re talking techno and drum n bass. old school tracks where all these sounds originally came from. We’re talking mashing of sounds like pretty lights and other creative outlets like the mad decent record label. The “edm bubble” is the sudden sweep of fans who used to listen to only top 40 and tupac on their ipods back in high school. Those are the people that like the pop sound of afrojack, tiesto and other big name hits, and especially borgore. Those people may or may not lose interest after a while and go back to listenign to wahtever the fuck it is they listen to but “Play what matters to you” is the truest statement Zimmerman has ever said.
Don’t forget he’s the one producing for Paris Hilton xD
with mau5 too
Joel hangs out on the internet to much lol so many memes.
Seeeriously. When I couldn’t find one good set being played the last closing hours of Sunday with pilled out people with outfits on from iheartraves.com, I thought to myself the bubble has to burst soon.
Seeeriously. When I couldn’t find one good set being played the last closing hours of Sunday with pilled out people with outfits on from iheartraves.com, I thought to myself the bubble has to burst soon.
While both have valid points, if you think meter and tempo are all that defines a song you’re an idiot.
Do u guys remember when the robots said that they thought’ EDM’ was a guy and not a genre? yeah.. I think that says it all. No need to talk about it. Which side am I on, you ask? Mau5’s. Afrojack is shit and overrated. At least Mau5 has a point.. a good point. Afro is just defending the fact that he can get away with making a piece of shit track and sell and every kid is going to go for it. I mean, kids go to EDC, ULTRA, whatever to listen to this shit anyways, right? They don’t go to listen to a live band or proper “professor music”. So obviously Afrojack is good on that side.. But dude, have u ever been to a Deadmau5 gig? That shit goes from Raving your shit out to all the way sentimental. That’s DANCE MUSIC for me. There are only a FEW artists that do this. Nick is simply not one of em. Sometmes a shitty bic mac is ok, he says. The problem is that Afrojack is already fucked on high cholesterol and diabetes. That’s what his music is. And w/e, EDM is being bought anyways. It’s not like this shit is going to last for long. It’s going to die just like pop died.
Hence why artists like Pretty lights arent using samples from pre-exsisting vinyl anymore. Hence why producers like bassnectar are constantly successful. THEY MAKE UNIQUE MUSIC. They dont dance on their DJ tables while a track is spinning they actually put on a live show. God help DJs like borgore who are glorified for exploiting women and treating them like animals. Shits weak.
Yeah I think these guys are arguing for the same point. Their perspectives are just at different angels. If you make EMD and it sounds good, it is good. I think EMD is great and its only going to progress. Yes there are popular styles and trends but that will never go away because people like what they like and trends come and go. So what’s the big deal here? I think Afro said it best though. “it’s simple, if you make good music, you succeed, if you don’t, you won’t” Short and concise. EMD is just a General Genre, make whatever inspires you and good things will come of it and if your a dope producer people will be inspired as well.
Vincent Nguon that’s actually a rumor. a tweet from him on june 4th in regards to that: “it just sucks that you think i would cooperate on exploiting something ive been doing 14 years like that”
so why doesn’t deadmau5 make something revolutionary already and shut everyone up? less social media, more producing the next revolution in this genre, oh “Great engineering genius”.
Whoaaaaaa — you’re seriously going to say mau5’s songs don’t sound the same???????? You’re kidding right?
I have 3 points I’d like to make:
1. What if good music IS music that matters to you? That’s how it is for me anyways. Music that ONLY matters to you, but isn’t good, can’t really go very far, while good music can be played for generations. If your not happy with what EDM sounds like now, get a freakin’ DAW and work up your production skills so you can MAKE WHAT YOU THINK EDM SHOULD BE.
2. Art must have order, if it’s to be at all listenable/viewable (for all those who took music theory, that’s how virtually all music was during the baroque and classical era: it all had a certain order). I get a lot of pleasure in the predictability of a general house track template, actually. And in fact, if you think about it, having a set template almost leads to more creativity, because it allows you to focus on creating a new song of a certain genre, not making a new way of thinking (if you’re creating a whole new genre, however, that’s a completely different matter).
3. Everything that’s good grows. EDM has been like that. It has followed The Coolness , which is what happens to everything cool, and has (essentially) following phases:
1. Creation
2. Accumulation of a good few very devoted fans.
3. Initial steady growth.
4. General acceptance as cool in society and fan base (a lot of hipsters jump off at this point).
5. Exponential growth
6. Assimilation into pop culture.
7. Fade out of pop culture (post-phase).
This happens with every style of music, or really anything that catches on: and always will happen as long as there are those of the hipster mentality. And in reality, how many of you complainers actually know what this golden “real” EDM scene was like (around phase 2-3)? I can tell you I don’t. I have been in it for around 3 or so years now, as a highly devoted fan of EDM (call me a noob, but I know my stuff), and I’ve always been searching for what sounds good to me.
In closing (of a surprisingly long comment), there will always be good music out there, even in a genre that you think is collapsing and getting turned over to idiots. Make and evaluate your own opinion taste, don’t just take what popular people say without thinking it over. The independent thinker is what makes society great.
1000 foot tall afrojack vs 80 pound Joel……what a battle that will be.
1000 foot tall afrojack vs 80 pound Joel……what a battle that will be.
i fucking hate deadmau
deadmau tracks were only good cuz of some of the vocalist he had chosen in past for titles like longest road ghost n stuff and raise your weapons he is 90 percent character with a custom
deadmau tracks were only good cuz of some of the vocalist he had chosen in past for titles like longest road ghost n stuff and raise your weapons he is 90 percent character with a custom
Horrible Read again. QUIT ASSUMING YOU THINK YOU KNOW WHAT THE ARTIST THINKS. Joel is FAR from threatened by Afrojack. Afrojack would be lost if Joel showed him how he makes his tracks.
Totally with Deadmau5 on that. He may have boiled it down a bit too much and used some wrong terminology but if you have half a brain you can figure out what he’s trying to say. With festivals these days, its like hundreds of dollars for a ticket to see heaps of big DJ’s playing right? Well what’s the point of them even being there? They all play the SAME fucking songs and shit. Might as well keep the stages and venues etc and just chuck on some local DJ’s or a fucking CD player and halve the price of tickets and drinks. However, when you see something live like a Deadmau5 concert, Daft Punk, Digitalism, The Prodigy, Soulwax etc etc, THAT’S worth paying heavy bucks for to witness. THAT to me personally is one of the big awesome parts dance music.
Come’on guys.. There are many many more artists as Afrojack / Deadmau5 /… I Guess the biggest problem of today is people keep listening to this overrated EDM stuff, which today better could be named Electronic Pop Music. You have to look further yourself, go after that brilliant artist that you think it deserves more attention than the regular ones. The one that puts a bit more effort into his releases/tracks/set instead of clicking (read: copy-pasting) it all together within a day.
We are the stupid ones that pay the price to see the same list of artists playing the same records all over again. I don’t think you could put all the blame on the populair EDM artists, a really big part of this whole thing are all the people that don’t dig a little bit deeper and keep following the current EDM religion/virus that is spreading.
The fuck is this shit? This is old news…not trying to be a buzzkill but you guys needs to step up your game or at least your current events…ppl don’t want to hear the same shit every week unless it has major updates. You’re like a month late. And on commercialized EDM, you’re about 5 years late.
Afrojack is a fucking commercial dj already, all his recent.songs have the same sound.. and joel should stay away from all the drama they are both fucking up edm
you want to know what’s the ugly truth? well ill explain the fault of this all this big piece of shit is of the people who support that #shitstuff damm stop support fuckin shit bad try of music what sounds = to everyshit on beatport top 10.
Artist or CEO, music or money, This is what one think first when he “produce” (I let you a clue : one think to produce Paris Hilton, what is she know first for? being artist or rich?)…
Some people need just to accept who they are, and just stop pretend to be anyone else.. including if they do something whitout real talent or love in this. You make money, so ok let do this, you can tell it, people won’t fight you for it. You make music, no need to tell, people already know (or not).
Deadmau5 is completely right, saw this coming. And why was Dash Berlin on that panel….Trance is by itself almost separate from what we know as EDM.
Mau5 is right. I’m sick of the pattern of: 30 secs from a hit, loop, drop, hardstyle like bass. Cause that is all what U get at a festival if you go to see and listen to the “wolrd biggest dj’s”. It is just boring. Krewella, Afrojack, Hardwell, Avicii, Porter Robinson and all the others do the same. At Ultra Europe I thought that I was on a Black Sensation. The other fact is that most pf the regular Johns enjoy it. They are boozed and high as hell and they jump and jump listening to the same boring beat for two days. let’s just stick to the experimental side. EDM is all about going forward.
What’s an ” Afrojack “?
You know honestly these guys both make a good point. Joel isn’t wrong for feeling that “EDM” is becoming more commercial. A lot of what I’ve been hearing these days are people falling into a certain form and I’m not going to lie I too have fell into using the same form to create a track. Joel has always made music that is interesting and honestly refreshing. And he’s not wrong about paying attention to details when mixing and mastering your songs. That’s just a part of recording good music.
On the other hand Nick makes sense man. no one likes shitty music and everyones opinion of what exactly is shitty is different. I think Nick makes great music. After meeting him and getting some advice I think he’s a great person.
Generally the same ABABBA song format makes sense and has been used for ever. I heard once from a teacher if there is a form that works and makes money why not use it? My only problem with this is that the music would never evolve if there weren’t people like Joel to say otherwise. I’m more interested in the progress of music.
you need to practice your writing skills.
okay yah Deadmau5 is a good engineer , but seriously have you heard most of his albums? they clearly are the same samples just put into differnt songs and albums, Deadmau5 shit sounds ALL the same! Afrojack puts style and feels what the crowd would want to hear in his songs,, not only are his build ups fucken epic! , Any Dj can press play with an Afrojack album and rock a party, what happens when deadmau5 plays? la la la la la la,, cool,,,, neeeeeextt! his music sounds like some of tiestos first beginning albums its like come put a lil bit more effort and try some new shit sometiimes man,,,,, But it Sounds like “Joel” is jelous of the competition and its just his way of bitching like a lil teenager to me…
& Saying its changing? maybe because you show yourself with all kinds of hollywood people that then search up your music that then share it and then your songs go pretty much mainstream to the little p-tots and they start showing up to events , so now the bubble is getting close to bursting,, but don’t worry Deadmau5 your not the only to blame for that shit so don’t feel to bad 😀
Fuck your replies because I don’t care what your going to say ;P.